OK, we've solved Chop Shop T shirt puzzles, we've tracked down porn stars, we've debated politics. Now I need to all to help us solve a conundrum that actually helps us writers here at YBNBY.
Here's a post over on TechCrunch that gives some new stats about blogs and income, with the following generalization:
Among those with advertising, the mean annual investment in their blog is $1,800, but it’s paying off. The mean annual revenue is $6,000 with $75K+ in revenue for those with 100,000 or more unique visitors per month.
That's my bold, btw. And as you read down the comments, people seem to be agreeing with that - get a site that receives 100k unique visitors a month, and you should be pulling down $75k a year in revenue.
And then we have YesButNoButYes. Which, according to Google Analytics, last month had 250,000 unique visitors. Which is about average (we've maintained that number for over a year now).
And how much revenue did YBNBY pull down from all it's advertising systems COMBINED last month? Before expenses?
$1402.46.Which means that after we paid our server fees, subscriptions, other costs, and split the revenue between the writers, everyone got a couple hundred bucks each.
I'm not telling you all this to plead poverty - sure, it'd be nice to earn real cash, but we're happy doing this for the love. But after reading that article on Techcrunch, I'm just sitting here wondering, how on earth can we be earning so little from so much?
Any serious thoughts, advice, pointers from the regular suspects, would be VERY appreciated. That is all.
Stumble This
Reddit!
Those other guys are straight up porn sites.
It really wouldn't take much to get us there.
Also, how seriously should you take those numbers?
FWIW, some of the big guns like NY Times, Washington Post have had their troubles making $ on this internet thing.
Do you make the money based on how many clicks you send along? I'm looking at an add for some TV show and Carbon Copy Pro, which is some software I assume. Have no idea what it does but it sounds scammerish. Might not get a lot of clicks that way.
Sorry I don't have more insight.
Most of the ads are a CPM basis, cost per impression, so nope, doesn't really matter if you click or not (although I'd obviously encourage you to "support our sponsors").
Try getting Baierman to post articles with home photo shoots of Megan Fox instead of Israeli Dog Shit analysis techniques. Not that I'm shitting on that.
Scara,
Do you sell the 728x90 banners and box ads yourself? or are those filled by Adsense also?
Hey guys, I love your blog. Here's some feedback from my viewpoint:
1) Most of the blogs Arrington and Techcrunch are mentioning are probably topic-specific or business blogs. Makes it easier to monetize compared to a broad content blog like yours
2) Seems like you're doing mostly CPM display ads. I personally have an adblocker on, as do a lot of people, and that probably hurts the already bad monetization levels that those types of ads pay
3) In my experience, focusing on monetization for a few large websites, text links tend to work fairly well, if they're focused on the right demographic. Once again, your demo may be tough to pin down, but it's probably a pretty loyal bunch who wouldn't mind clicking a few ads for you guys (I know I wouldn't mind)
4) Sell some ads directly. It's a fair amount more work, but it could net you 20 or more times as much as going through display ad networks
Oops, one more item. For people using adblockers, DailyKos posted a little intro with instructions on how to disable the adblocker for their site. Might be helpful if you guys did a little prompting and provided those instructions as well. I just turned my adblocker off for you. Using Firefox with AdBlock Plus:
1) Go to Tools > AdBlock Plus
2) Click Add Filter
3) Enter @@http://*yesbutnotbutyes/*
4) Hit Apply and Refresh
So first you probably want to identify the problem in it's most basic form.
The stat you're quoting is about unique visitors but as you say your ads are Cost Per Impression. And (not that I would know I'm just taking your word for it) you get an average amount of unique visitors.
So is it safe to say that you're not looking to get more unique visitors necessarily (although I'm sure you'd like that too), but instead that you need the existing visitors to view more pages, or refresh more often?
If that's the case then from a viewers point of view it's a fairly easy answer. I would click on more pages if there was more content. Plain and simple. If there were more things to read I would spend more time at the site clicking around and making you more money.
I'm not complaining about lack of content necessarily. I'm quite happy to come here every day looking for a few laughs and to read some interesting conversations. But if you're specifically out to get more clicks then more frequently updated content would help.
I think the forums are a step in the right direction. Although I notice you don't have the ads up there yet, so you might want to consider that. I can't imagine people complaining, it's standard fare online for a free website.
And since you're asking for advice, here are another two of my cents:
- The "most popular stories" link needs to be updated. While I agree Jennifer Connelly has (had? don't know) a great body, I think that same pic has been there since I happened across this site over 7 months ago.
- Have more Breakfast Links each day. You have to compete for surfers' time with the hundreds of other sites out there peddling lists of links. More links = more clicks back and forth of course. And the Breakfast Links are quick and easy, no one needs to write a whole article around them. Perhaps some Lunch and Dinner Links are in order :o)
In summary. You have a lot of cool shit here, just keep that up and offer it in a greater quantity and I bet your page clicks and refreshes will improve.
Boobs. Plain and simple. Boobs = $$$
I'm Bill Clinton and I approve this message.
Annadeus - Great ideas, but you need to watch 'Fast Times At Ridgemont High'. That's not Jennifer Connelly.
For great pictures of Jennifer Connelly, we watch 'The Hot Spot'.
You are welcome.
Some blogs around here are trying ads on the feed too...
The volume of the comments here - with ads on its feed - would pay a huge barbecue in the 4th of July.
$75,000 a year "average" is BS. Someone is skewing the results. There's some blog with 100 million views per month (Kos?) that's pulling the average way out of line.
I recall getting a pitch to take this Technorati survey, but I was too busy and didn't.
oh....Phoebe....was trying to figure out the reference there....
Hokay, here's my $0.02. Annadeus' post above is on the right track. You have plenty of users, the key here is to get your ARPU up significantly. (Average Revenue Per User) The moving parts are:
1. Users - Your good content is driving this.
2. Page Views - Driven by the number of clicks through your site.
3. Clicks (Advertising $) - Clicking on an ad.
4. Sales / Revenue Sharing (deals with stores or your own store) - Someone buys a shirt and you get a fixed $. Even better $ if it is a 3rd party service.
5. Number of Visits / User - Much better $ if you can get a User to show up more often. Obsessively checking is even better.
6. Search Revenue / User - Where is your Google search bar?!?
7. $ / View, Click, Sale, Search - What you can negotiate from 3rd parties.
Right off the bat, you do not have a Search program with YBNBY. Back at my old ISP gig, we used to pull in an equal $ share from Search as we did from advertising. Essentially, you are leaving a big chunk of $ on the table by not providing a well-placed Google (or similar) search bar. Keep tweaking the bar once you get it installed to optimize...or borrow someone else's method.
Categories help. If you have a well-visited Video or Sports-related category, it will be worth more to advertisers than a general pile of fun stuff like you have today. Finance, Games, Horiscopes, Gambling and NSFW are really big money makers. Start organizing your posts in better buckets and place them in clickable categories off to the right.
Your front page is one looooog scroll-down with little incentive to click the post and read more. A format with more clicks = more page views = more $. Key here is to balance a reasonable number of clicks without pissing off your base. For example, the front page of www.darkroastedblend.com seems like a good balance to me.
Oh...I stopped visiting YBNBY from work b/c you post EVERYTHING on the front page - including some of the more questionable content. I love reading this stuff at home, but will not put my job at risk with someone buggering a potted plant popping up at work.
Your site could use some more ads. It's far from full.
Have any sites that launch from YBNBY pop up in a new window - always keeping your site open in the background.
Personally, I like it when you and yours write up original content. All of you have great personality and writing styles - more depth into your content would be a reason for me to come back to your site more frequently. The best stuff from YBNBY that I submit to reddit always seems to be something special that you write up. (Never the short blurbs or YouTube videos.) Color commentary and insight all the way.
You seem to go through bursts of posts at irregular times, which causes me to not hit 'refresh' on YBNBY more than once per day.
Always hunt out there for better advertising $ from third parties. You might want to try and sell some advertising yourself, but then again you appear to be a bunch of 'creatives' - my opinion is that you should stick to content in that case.
...enough for now. I really like your site and enjoy the collection of bloggers you have brought together. It would be great to see you make some more $ to show for your efforts.
- El Queso Grande
Heh - you DO have a search program up above! It's just lurking. Time to get that puppy out in the open much, much more.
Well I agree with elque as far as I could follow. He must know this stuff. I will say, my workplace is pretty cool but I'm sure some of my coworkers think Im a bit off when they check out the Get Sexy w/YBNBY yes pic. Maybe more back page stuff that is.
Im down btw, just at work and all.
Pheobe Cates <> Jennifer Connelly. True Dat.
Two excellent tastes, for sure, but I don't see how Pheobe can be beat. That's a mature decision on my part.
1. You don't know how much you are worth. ie alta vista
2. You need to be shameless and promote yourself to death. ie Richard Branson
3. Get a good sales guy to push YBNBY into advertisers' faces. ie That insurance guy in Groundhog Day; again and again and...
4. Light up some incense sticks and meditate. ie Bhagwan Sri Rajneesh
Thanks Big Cheese, your insights are helpful.
Who are you using for your CPM based ads?
That might have something to do with it - perhaps your ad network is taking more than it should? Have you looked around and tried out its competitors?
Plain and simple, you have to whore yourself off with ads like hell. Sadly though, the more you whore yourself off, the less readers you'll probably get as the ads will just annoy them and they'll go away. Personally I think you should keep up what you are doing as if you are already doing this for the love of the game, it'll get notice and take off at some point. (Besides, I've been repping my shirt at concerts here in SC so hopefully that'll help out)
Maybe you could use a side bar with easier access to the archives, maybe monthly for the current year and yearly for the rest.
It would help us (and the new comers) to find out cool things that are far behind and keep the interest of seeking through the old posts to find new stuff.
But as BD said... you don't have to whore yourselves 'uglifying' the site and keeping only the regulars, for it would be scary for the new comers, since you are doing that because you like it.
I tried to ask some friends to come and visit, but the language ends up being a barrier down here...
By the way, do you have a geographic statistic for the visits? Just curious.
Definitely making the content easier to access would make YBNBY more useful to the casual user, and would give you more places to put targeted ads.
You should, at those traffic levels, be able to find a sponsor, kind of like they do in AA. YBNBY, presented by Old Spice or, say, Tucks Medicated Pads, would be a nice fit, especially if you could blend the advertising into the site (see your post on Seth McFarlane's cavalcade - see how he makes his sponsor a fun, seamless part of the site? Yeah, do that.)
Make Johnny pay you a dollar for every monkey placement.
Sell more stuff as a third party vendor, not just as an advertiser. In other words, don't just promote the Ask A Ninja book, movies, or comics in occasional posts - sell them.
I personally would prefer to buy from you guys if I had the option. I have no idea what the margin on that would be, but if you could turn a profit on the products, I think you'd have buyers. At the very least, partner w/ distributors so you get a promotional cut.
You will always be pulling in more readers, but keeping the loyal 77+ coming back... and often should be a main goal. I think your new forum will help greatly with that. When you get it in the shape you are happy with and start promoting it, your regular audience will be coming much more frequently as the forum becomes more active.
You have a cool thing going and I hope you all get stinking, filthy rich.
1400 bones with that many hits is a little low.
I am kind of wondering if this little post is just Scaramouch trying keep a cover on the cash that he is really bringing in.
Perhaps writing this article is just a way to cover his ass for not paying the YBNBY staff as much as they deserve.
It's a typical British tactic to try to tax the American's. This isn't new. King George tried it on us years ago.
I say to the other YBNBY staff: Don't buy it. He's making suckers out of all of you. Think about it, 200,000 hits per month, tied with your individual writing talent's, only bringing in a couple hundred bones per month!
That's an outrage!
I call for a YBNBY writers strike, a YBNBY tea party if you will.
No more taxation without representation!
If history has taught us anything, it has taught us to not trust the British when it comes to our money.
Last night, I purchased the rights, and will be starting a new blog site called:
YesButYesButYes.com
I will be contacting the majority of the writers from YBNBY and offering salary positions that will start double of what you are paid now, until the site takes off and revenue surpasses that of the new salary. This will of course require you to leave YBNBY.
I'm sorry to do this Scaramouch, but I hate to see you screw my friends.
As for the regular readers I ask you sincerely to jump on board the YesButYesButYes train to entertainment and ejoy the ride of your life.
Love Dave.
I mean enjoy not ejoy.
Hell, I guess I'm not up for it I can't even spell enjoy.
Plus Scaramouch, you kn0w I love you and would not do that to you my British pal.
You have got to admit that would be funny if I tried something like that.
Dave, we are making a lot more than we did back when we got nothin... but I now realize I am the only active author (besides Scaramouch) left from those pre-ad service times.
Which gives me curmudgeon rights! You all don't know how good you have it. Back when I started contributing to YBNBY, we got NO money! We did it for the exposure! And we LIKED it!
Miss C. -
I think you do a great job, along with all of the talented 'greenhorns' at YBNBY.
I appreciate the entertainment, and providing me with a place to satisfy my cyberbullying addiction.
I sincerely hope that YBNBY will make all of you stinking rich.
Each of you have a unique talent to bring to the table, and deserve nothing but loads of bacon smelling money.
A quick note to thank everyone for their input so far (apart from Dave - Dude, you're no help at all) - it's given me a lot to process and ruminate on. Stay tuned.
In Mother Russia, authors pay blog.
Bacon smelling money? As long as it is "bacon scented" and not made the same way you created bacon dog doo Dave, I'm all for it.
As for Scara, he's an upstanding bossman. And he's often throwing in a little extra when the ad fill isn't huge but the content is strong. He rarely edits me or comes down on me for what I post. And I'm the first one to realize some things I cover are of questionable taste. Especially for a front page of a site people often look at at work. I'm ever grateful for that.
Plus, he picks up the check when the group goes out for drinks. For that alone, he deserves major props.
Baier-That's spoken like a true company man.
Scaramouche-
I know deep down that you love me.
I also know deep down that you hate me.
That leaves me acting as two functions. Which can be somewhat difficult to understand. Are we in the positive or in the negative?
Integrate the equation by parts and you will understand how much of the positive area I control in your world.
That should give you a better idea if I am good or bad for you and YBNBY.
I think you know know the answer without even having to do the calculation.
I suggest the calculation. It's safer.
Love Dave
See? That's what I'm talking about.
Did these comments get Phoebe Cates moved from the popular links? Man, cowing to pressure so soon, are we?
Mouche'-( I know you dig the e on the end of your name)
I'm trying to help you. Dig deep into the understanding of my comments. There are so many unwritten meanings hidden inside.
Secrets, secrets to life.
Dig deep, very deep.
I can help you if you let me.
Scaramouche', I am here to help not to hurt.
Ok, sometimes I hurt, but that is what I like to do.
I also like to help.
Did that help?
Helped me, thanks mang.
Dave----
I used that website name last week on the Johnny Wright in front of the shower w/guitar post (go ahead, check....I'll wait)
You back? Okay, I'll take the line stealing as a compliment....
and in exchange all I want is some mineral rights from your property....
And...as the brainchild of Johnny and Echo, aren't you just leading yourself away?
Dave----
I used that website name last week on the Johnny Wright in front of the shower w/guitar post (go ahead, check....I'll wait)
You back? Okay, I'll take the line stealing as a compliment....
and in exchange all I want is some mineral rights from your property....
And...as the brainchild of Johnny and Echo, aren't you just leading yourself away?
(internet issues again....or I think Dave needs to be hit over the head with the message--you decide!)
How bout nobutyesbutno.com or nobutnobutno.com. Why yesbutnobutyes anyway? What's the real story?
maybe it was Cindy's answer when Scara asked her out or proposed.....
maybe toss your idiot brother-in-law Johnny Wright, that would be a good start, what a waste of air.
I'll let the Loyal 77 deal with that one.
As for YesButNoButYes....
go to http://www.hbo.com/littlebritainusa/ and click the "Vicky" video link
Let's see....blue comment--means someone not willing to register...
and an insult on one of my favorite writers (all you have to do is read about his spa visit and you will be a convert)...
looks like the evil twin Johnny Rong is jealously waiting in the wings (wearing black leather gloves as he types) for Mr. Wright to lose his gig so Rong can take what should have been his all along [insert evil laugh here]...
Okay, so I grew up watching a lot of soap operas....sue me.
If it wasn't properly written, I'd say it was our friend (?) Tommy Boy bullying around... or maybe it's one more of his faces, like those commenters that have sent us misleading messages when Dave was missing.
Or maybe it's just JW trying to check his acceptance between us readers.
Or maybe is the evil twin, as s.o. said...
I'm guilty too, s.o. , I grew up watching soaps too... In fact, I think we produce 80% of the world soap operas, and export them. Even to mother Russia.
But I think we should ignore this blinky's desire. After the bathroom song video, if his writings were not good enough (I think they are), JW proved us he belongs to the Loyal 77. Let's keep him.
Our good buddy JW is too smooth to need our defense from such frivolous personal attacks; especially those hidden in anonymity.
JW, with much respect to Mel Brooks, just keep on doing that voodoo, that you do, so well.
So, I'm not fired?
It was pins and needles for a bit there. I did like the phrase "waste of air." Don't know what that means. Is there an audio version of YBNBY I'm not aware of? I'll check iTunes.
JW,
I think the proposal on the table is that you not only should be banashed from contributing to this website, but your daily use of air should be severely restricted. In final critique, it appears to be that your life is meaningless.
Apparently, your clever and self-deprecating commentary is no longer welcome here on earth. Perhaps you should take our guest's advice and adopt a self-fulfilling, meaningful life full of one-time, anonymous stinkpostings.
Nice.
I enjoy the little jabs take at me. They're entertaining. Arrogance is sometimes a good thing.
Most of the time, the poster of them seems to have limited intelligence and verbal skills. If that is the case, and I am speculating a great deal, I don't want them to like my writing. It's a good thing. Like people that don't get The Ramones or Coen brothers films. I don't want you to like them.
Johnny,
I like your writing and I have limited intellegence and verbal skills.
Does that make me not count?
How the hell do I get nailed as a suspect whenever someone like Blinky appears.
I mean seriously, If I want something to hurt, I am going to use something a little more ballsy and hurtful than calling Johnny a waste of air.
Plus I love J-dub. I wouldn't hurt him that way. I would hurt him indirectly by insulting something precious to him like the Basketball team formerly known as the Supersonics.
It does lead me to another question.
Blinky called Scaramouch Johnnys Brother in Law?
Are you guy's related like that???
Binky I bet your a source of embarrassment wherever you go.
He's like those guys we never invite to a party, and when he asks us why, in the other day we escape with some kind of "haven't you got your email?" or "but I left a message on your answering machine..."
Yeah Binky... now you know the truth...
Damn. Why is Binky so mad? Reverend, are you using those fancy words again?!?!
I've been trying to keep it below four syllables, but it's a challenge to do so.
Johnny, I love you for your limited intelligence and verbal skills and air-to-waste ratio. Blinky (which isn't even her real name, it's Doris) just doesn't understand. She's the same lady who though Clay Aiken was a gay man, for goodness sakes.
What would she know?
From now on, just remember to only read the comments from people who don't post under a dopey obvious pseudonym. Real-named people are your true fans, despite your limitations as a writer and as a human being.
So cheer up! It isn't like Blinky/Doris moved your favorite basketball team to Oklahoma City or something crazy like that!
First time any of you reprobates complimented my "limited intelligence and verbal skills. and "limitations as a writer and as a human being." Thank you. About time. I should be getting pity points for trying.
I am doing word searches in the newspaper to boost my thinking. Just found the word "cheese." It was tricky. There is a bunch of "EE" combinations scattered about. I'm smarter already.
JW--would it help if I told you I faked it every time I threw you a compliment?
I just don't know what to believe anymore. I don't know who I am...
We L77ers like to keep our writers on their toes.....
And now you know how we felt when Dave 'disappeared' earlier this month...the mind games go both ways, oh great one....
Waste of air? Ouch JW, i'm sorry man. I don't think that was called for. Douchebag, maybe but damn, waste of air? That aint right.
Wear that insult loud and proud my friend.
Syllables? I had a big bowl of syllables this morning. I don't know how you get four down at one time.